The first thing you notice about Dr. Meghan Holst is her enthusiasm. It radiates through her words like sunlight through shallow water, especially when discussing her eight-armed friends or toothy research subjects. An esteemed researcher on sharks and octopuses, she's made it her mission to transform how we see these often misunderstood creatures.
You might know her voice from Sharkpedia, the hit podcast she co-hosts with fellow marine scientist Amani Weber-Schultz. But today, she's sitting down with us to share something different: her journey through the world of marine biology, her thoughts on diversity in marine science, and why she believes sharks deserve better PR.
In this wide-ranging conversation, we explore everything from the hidden lives of octopuses to the future of ocean conservation. We've edited our chat for clarity, but we've kept the spark that makes Dr. Holst's perspective unique. Grab your diving gear – we're about to take the plunge.
The Contents Of The Interview
Questions About Her Passion:
1. What sparked your interest in marine biology?
Unfortunately, I don't have a very direct answer, I've always been interested in creatures. Some of my earliest memories are of collecting bugs & fishing! I used to stop people from killing spiders, I've always been an advocate for creatures in general & their conservation. I've also always been interested in the novelty of the ocean. There is so much we don't know about the ocean, it's almost like outer space.
2. Do you have a person, place, or moment that helped spark your interest in marine biology?
I'm not sure, however, I learned to fish as a young child. Eating fish, gutting them, & seeing their anatomy was always highly interesting to me. I was always a little scientist.
3. What attracts you to sharks & what is your favorite species of shark?
I got lucky in that I had access to them. Once again I've always been interested in fish as well as fish biology, & sharks are really large cartilaginous fish. As soon as I had access to them, I jumped at the opportunity to research them.
I'm very hesitant to choose one favorite species, I think I'd have to say that the Broadnose Sevengill Shark is my favorite. I did my PhD on Broadnose Sevengill Sharks, they are the center of where I started in Shark Biology. They are truly how I began as a Shark Biologist.
4. What attracts you to Science Communication?
I feel that science communication is incredibly important. If we are doing science & not communicating it to the public, there will be a huge disconnect. Communicating science can also be very beneficial to scientists, it's amazing to see people get excited about what you're saying. Watching the light turn on in people's eyes is very fun.
Questions About Her Career:
5. How did you end up going to University for marine biology & which universities did you go to before landing at UC Davis?
I went for my undergraduate degree at Oregon State University because originally I wanted to study whales. There is this wonderful laboratory there called the Hatfield Marine Science Center that is in Newport, Oregon, that is right on the ocean. It gives you direct access to study science, & to study large mammals. That is what drew me to Oregon State. In the end, I ended up switching paths from mammals to fish, which I am very grateful for.
After leaving Oregon, I went to San Francisco State University for my Master's Degree, where I ended up studying Octopi.
6. What inspired you to found the Minorities in Zoo & Aquarium Science organization, & what programs does it have?
I spent the first two decades of my career working in Aquariums. When I left Oregon State University after I finished my undergraduate, I worked as an aquarist. It's a pretty predominantly white field in my opinion, & with the way that a lot of internships are structured, you have to do lots of free work before getting a job. Even when you do get into a position that pays, the pay is not very sustainable. At one point I considered leaving Aquarium Sciences to become a teacher because if I were a teacher, I would likely be working the same amount yet earning much more money. This is fairly prevalent in aquariums across the United States. Although it is difficult for everyone, I saw that it was disproportionately affecting minorities, & that ethnic as well as racial minorities were facing many additional challenges.
I don't wish to discourage readers from following this career path, it is gradually getting better, however, this is what sparked my idea for Minorities in Aquarium & Zoo Sciences. I am not an ethnic or racial minority, I would like to be very transparent about that, I simply saw a very frustrating issue.
My co-founder Jenny Jansen, who is also the president of the organization, is Chinese American. So before starting, I had gone to Jenny & told her what I was observing in our industry, & asked her if I was correct in that it was disproportionately impacting people of color. She agreed that it was, which led to the birth of the organization.
Although I would say that Aquarium Sciences are a predominantly female field, leadership roles are often male, & most often are not people of color.
Ultimately, we launched Minorities in Aquarium & Zoo Sciences to try & uplift as well as amplify people of color because they are so disproportionately impacted by the financial impacts of getting into this field.
As for the programs we currently have, I'm quite proud of one in particular. The acronym for it is AMLAZ, which stands for Advancing Minority Leadership in Aquariums & Zoos. The program is to help fund mid-level leaders that are people of colour in these sciences to go through leadership programs to help them advance their skills & uplift their communities. We also offer scholarships for other programs, if you are a person of colour & are doing an unpaid internship, we can help you get funding for living expenses covered when the institution isn't able to do so.
Our mission is not only to retain the diversity that we currently have but ultimately to increase it. Quite frankly, we would like to not be needed at some point, & for the industry to catch up.
7. What did you do in your capacity as a Senior Biologist & Aquarist for Aquariums?
As I mentioned before, I worked as an Aquarist for the first 2 decades or so of my career. When I got out of my bachelor's degree, I didn't exactly know what to do. I thought that I would be one of those people who get out of their undergraduate & go straight to their Master's Degree & had science figured out, however when I got out of my undergraduate, I didn't know what I could do for my master's degree.
I ended up being incredibly fortunate & finding a job in Aquarium Sciences, & fell in love with it. As an intern, I would often go scuba diving to help with conservation surveys. On the same day, I would manage a touch pool, & give talks about the conservation research that we were doing. That was the beginning of my work in Science Communication, it was amazing. I found it incredibly fulfilling to work at an aquarium where I could do science, support science, & lead science, & in the same breath make it accessible to the public!
After a while, I began at an aquarium in Oregon, taking care of Octopi. I started asking all these questions about their behavior that people didn't necessarily have the answer to, which pushed me further into the field.
My curiosity deepened, & my boss at the time asked me to evaluate if it was human interactions were negative or positive, to make sure that we were respecting their boundaries.
After moving to California, I had this assessment that I had made in Oregon, & expanded on it at my new job. I began to become curious as to what was going on at a cellular level with these animals, & how it affected their behavior. That ultimately started my Master's Project, & had me work as a full-time aquarist during my master's degree.
8. What did you do in your capacity as a Marine Biological Researcher with Oregon State University in the Computational Mechanics & Design Laboratory?
That was an odd position that I got while studying for my undergraduate degree. That laboratory is an engineering laboratory that needed a marine biologist to help them in a whale-tagging project. I went to Oregon State originally intending to be a whale researcher, & they wanted someone on the biological side of things who could study the differences in blubber between different groups of whales, & then explain how that would affect the way that the tag is implanted.
Interestingly, I met my then-boyfriend, now husband there! He was working on the mechanical side of things studying how to get the tags to function properly.
9. How did you gain an interest in Scuba Diving, & what did you do in your capacity as a Divemaster?
When I went to Oregon State, they had a program where you could take a class to learn Scuba Diving from a certified diver. I knew that I would likely end up needing the skill to properly do research, so I took the course & got the certification. I got to know the course instructor extremely well, & trained to become a diver master alongside him. I ended up helping him instruct some of his classes, & going out into the ocean to help get people certified. It was an amazing experience, so I've been able to use diving in my career ever since then.
10. What is the most fulfilling or proudest moment in your career thus far?
Some of my best moments have been when I see other people learning & getting access to things. I worked incredibly hard for a very long time to gain access to marine science, & it was not easy. My proudest moments are generally when I help other people gain access to science. For example, when I take other people on the boat with me to learn how to do shark fishing to support shark science, it is extremely fulfilling to watch them get excited & realize that they can get close to sharks.
To not only learn about these animals but to watch other people learn about these animals, makes me very excited! It is sort of addicting.
Overall, I would have to say that my proudest moment was watching one of the undergraduate students studying under me gradually learn more about shark science, write their thesis, & eventually work with me.
11. What is the biggest challenge or hurdle that you have faced in your career thus far?
Quite frankly, my biggest challenge is other people not wanting me or other groups of people in this field. It is not always a welcoming field, although I do feel that is gradually changing. I have faced my fair share of exclusion & hardship, simply existing in the field.
The hardest part is the people who will randomly take action against your ability to do science. I do not completely understand the motivation behind that, it doesn’t exactly make sense to me.
I distinctly remember that as an undergrad, my biology professor took me aside & told me to change my degree, because I would never be successful in biology. People will make you feel as if you don’t have the right to be here, or as if you don’t belong, which has driven me to be as inclusive as possible. I try to share as much as possible & be as inclusive as possible. I’m grateful that that’s how I have come out the other side as opposed to being bitter about it, & perpetuating that cycle of exclusion.
12. Do you have any words for new marine biologists entering the field?
Take the opportunities you can, they don’t often come. If there is anything that you can do, take it. Say yes as much as possible.
The other thing that I would like to say is, at the same time, do not lose yourself in that process. It may feel like you need to sacrifice your soul for any opportunity, however, that isn’t true. As you are getting into the field, people may attempt to take advantage of you. Some professors are simply looking for bodies to fill roles, & they may not have your best interest in mind. Always listen to your gut & put yourself first, as no one else is going to.
13. How do you feel about the current public perception of sharks as menacing beasts, & do you wish to change it?
I feel as if that is gradually changing thankfully. They aren’t these man-eating beasts that people seem to think that they are. One of my favorite statistics is that you are more likely to get killed by a vending machine than you are a shark. The likelihood is so low.
Overall, I think that it is getting better, however there is still room to grow.
Questions About Her Research:
14. How many research projects have you been involved in & what was your first research project?
The first research project that I was a part of was the whale tagging project at Oregon State University, & the first time leading research was during my Master’s Degree when I made the octopus assessment.
15. What research are you currently conducting at the UC Davis School of Veterinary Sciences?
I am currently what is called a Postdoctoral Fellow, people call it a post-doc for short. A Post-Doc is a temporary position people usually do after their P.hD, as most universities will not hire you immediately after you have finished your P.hD. A post-doc helps you gain more experience, & do your research while having something to fall back on.
Getting a post-doc is entirely dependent on funding. I'm studying freshwater fish in this position, as that is where funding was. In this project, the leading professor wanted to hire somebody to lead a project looking for contaminants in the San Francisco Bay estuary, & I studied sharks in San Francisco Bay which is very close. I work very closely with a toxicologist looking at how pollution affects sharks & fish in the bay.
Questions About Her Science Communication & Outreach:
16. How did you begin your Sharkpedia podcast & when did you begin it?
We began it in 2021, my co-host Amani Weber-Schultz & I, I’m not even entirely sure how we came up with the idea! I do remember that I was in a Science Communication Class for my P.hd, & part of it was that we had to come up with a science communication project.
I had always been interested in the notion of starting a podcast, however I was very intimidated by it. I sort of used the excuse of it being for class as a reason to try, & see if my friend would be willing to help me. It was a very selfish, very amazing way to meet other scientists in the field. The point of Sharkpedia is that we have scientists come on & talk about how they conduct research, what led to it, & what struggles they had doing the science. That was a very excellent way for both my co-host & I, who were both P.hd students at the time, to learn a lot about the field.
Many great collaborations came out of it, and several people on the podcast ended up collaborating with me on research & other things. It was the perfect project to do as P.hd students. We unfortunately have had a small hiatus as Amani is at the end of her P.hd right now & she is grinding away. We are planning to come back this next year thankfully! It is a great way to connect with other scientists, & share science with other people.
17. Who is your co-host for the Sharkpedia podcast?
Amani Weber-Schultz is a friend of mine, she volunteered with me once when I was working as an Aquarist. She co-founded Minorities In Shark Sciences which helped inspire me to start Minorities in Aquarium & Zoo Sciences. She is an incredible human, I am inspired by her all the time. She has studied the mechanics of dermo denticles, which are the scales on Sharks, quite extensively. She’s Awesome!
18. Have you considered doing a video version of the podcast or an animated version of the podcast?
We have not considered an animated version of the podcast or a video portion, mostly because it is more editing on our part.
19. Do you have any final questions about sharks, science communication, or marine biology in general?
If you are passionate & you want to be in this field, don’t let anyone tell you that don’t belong here.
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